Remember the first time you customized your MySpace profile? Or the thrill of stumbling onto a random website through StumbleUpon? Or recording a six-second Vine that felt like a mini movie?
If any of those ring a bell, you’ve been on the internet long enough to watch some of its biggest stars fade away.
Over the past two decades, dozens of websites that once commanded hundreds of millions of users have shut their virtual doors. Some were crushed by competitors. Others made catastrophic product decisions. A surprising number were acquired by tech giants — then quietly killed.
This article walks through 30 famous websites that no longer exist, organized by category, with the story behind each shutdown. At the end, we’ll explore a question many domain investors ask: can these dead domains still hold real value? (Spoiler: many of them can.)
Let’s take a trip down internet memory lane.
The Social Networks That Ruled Before Facebook
Before Facebook swallowed the social media world whole, there was a brutal war for our attention. These platforms were once the place to be online.
MySpace (myspace.com) — The OG Social Network
Peak: ~100 million monthly active users (2006–2008) Status: Domain alive, but transformed into a music/entertainment info site
MySpace was the social network. If you were online between 2004 and 2008, you probably spent hours customizing your profile with glittery backgrounds, embedding songs that auto-played, and obsessing over your Top 8 friends list. At its peak, MySpace was the most visited website in the United States.
Then Facebook happened. With its cleaner design and real-name policy, Facebook made MySpace feel cluttered and anonymous. MySpace was sold to Specific Media in 2011 for $35 million — a fraction of the $580 million News Corp had paid for it in 2005. Today, myspace.com still exists as a slimmed-down entertainment site, but the social network is long gone.
The lesson: User experience trumps first-mover advantage, every time.
Friendster (friendster.com) — Where Social Networking Was Born
Peak: 115 million registered users Status: Domain repurposed for gaming
Friendster launched in 2002 and is widely credited as the first major social network. It grew explosively — until its servers couldn’t keep up. Pages took forever to load, users got frustrated, and the migration to MySpace (and later Facebook) was swift.
By 2015, Friendster had officially shut down. The domain was later repurposed for a gaming platform.
The lesson: Technical infrastructure isn’t glamorous, but it can make or break a product. Performance issues alone can kill even the most beloved platform.
Orkut (orkut.com) — Google’s First Social Flop
Peak: 300+ million registered users (dominant in Brazil and India) Status: Domain redirects to Google community pages
Named after its creator, Google engineer Orkut Büyükkökten, Orkut was massive in Brazil and India. In Brazil, “orkuting” was a verb. But Google never gave it the investment it needed to compete with Facebook’s global expansion. In September 2014, Google pulled the plug.
The lesson: Even Google can fail at social. Regional dominance doesn’t protect you from a well-funded global competitor.
Bebo (bebo.com) — The $850 Million Mistake
Peak: 40+ million users (UK, Ireland, New Zealand) Status: Domain status uncertain
Bebo was the go-to social network for teenagers in the UK and Ireland. AOL acquired it for $850 million in 2008 — one of the most overpriced acquisitions in tech history. Just two years later, it was essentially worthless as Facebook’s international expansion swept through Bebo’s core markets.
The lesson: Timing matters. Buying a social network at peak hype, right before a platform shift, is a recipe for write-downs.
Google+ (plus.google.com) — The $500 Million Social Experiment
Peak: 400 million registered accounts (many forced through Gmail integration) Status: Domain redirects to Google account pages
Google+ was Google’s most ambitious attempt to build a social network. It launched with fanfare in 2011, complete with features like Circles and Hangouts. But despite forcing Google+ integration into Gmail and YouTube, Google couldn’t make people actually want to use it. A data breach affecting 500,000 users became the final nail. The consumer version shut down in April 2019.
The lesson: You can’t force social adoption through product bundling. Users need an intrinsic reason to engage.
Content Discovery Platforms We Miss
Before algorithmic feeds took over, these platforms pioneered the idea of “surfing the web” — discovering new content through curation and community.
StumbleUpon (stumbleupon.com) — The Internet’s Greatest Discovery Engine
Peak: 30+ million users Status: Domain redirects to mix.com
Click the StumbleUpon button, land on something fascinating. That was the deal, and it was addictive. StumbleUpon served you random web pages based on your interests — from obscure blogs to bizarre interactive experiments. For many users, it was how they discovered the best of the web.
In 2018, the team rebranded as Mix, pivoting toward curated collections. But the magic of serendipitous discovery was lost. StumbleUpon remains one of the most-missed platforms in internet history.
The lesson: Serendipity is powerful but hard to monetize. The pivot to Mix shows how difficult it is to sustain a discovery-first business model.
Digg (digg.com) — The Cautionary Tale of Product Redesigns
Peak: Top 100 website globally, tens of millions of daily page views Status: Domain alive as a tech news aggregator (acquired by BuySellAds)
Digg was the original Reddit. Users submitted links, the community voted, and the best content rose to the top. It was a daily ritual for millions of tech-savvy internet users.
Then came Digg v4 in 2010 — a redesign that removed core community features, promoted publisher content over user submissions, and alienated virtually its entire user base. The migration to Reddit was almost instant. Digg was eventually sold for parts and relaunched as a curated tech news site under BuySellAds.
The lesson: Digg v4 is the textbook example of how a single product redesign can destroy a beloved platform overnight.
Delicious (del.icio.us) — The Social Bookmarking Pioneer
Peak: Millions of users (acquired by Yahoo in 2005) Status: Domain defunct
Before Pinterest, before Pocket, there was Delicious. It let you save and tag web bookmarks online, then share them with the world. The concept was simple but revolutionary. Yahoo acquired it in 2005 but never figured out how to integrate it into its ecosystem. After multiple ownership changes, Delicious shut down for good in 2017.
The domain hack — del.icio.us — remains one of the most creative uses of a domain extension in internet history.
The lesson: Great product concepts can still fail without a sustainable business model. And domain hacks, while memorable, can be hard to maintain long-term.
The Video Platforms That Disappeared
Before YouTube dominated online video (and before TikTok changed short-form content), these platforms were shaping how we watched and created video online.
Vine (vine.co) — Six Seconds That Changed Culture
Peak: 200+ million registered users Status: Domain owned by Twitter/X, occasionally redirects
Vine’s six-second looping videos spawned an entire generation of creators and catchphrases. “Do it for the Vine” was a cultural phenomenon. Stars like Logan Paul, Lele Pons, and King Bach built careers on the platform. Twitter acquired Vine in 2012 for $30 million but failed to develop its monetization or creator tools. Vine shut down in January 2017.
The irony? ByteDance launched TikTok globally later that same year, proving that short-form video was one of the biggest opportunities in tech. Vine was years ahead of its time — and was killed too soon.
The lesson: Format innovation is incredibly valuable. Vine proved that ultra-short video could be compelling; it just needed better business execution.
Musical.ly (musical.ly) — The App That Became TikTok
Peak: 200+ million users (primarily Gen Z) Status: Domain redirects to tiktok.com
Musical.ly was the lip-sync video app that captured the hearts of teenagers worldwide. In 2017, ByteDance acquired Musical.ly and merged its user base into TikTok. The Musical.ly brand was retired, and the domain now simply redirects to TikTok.
It’s a rare case where a “defunct” website didn’t really die — it was absorbed into something much bigger.
The lesson: Sometimes the best outcome for a startup is acquisition and integration. Musical.ly’s DNA lives on in one of the world’s most popular apps.
Quibi (quibi.com) — The $1.75 Billion Six-Month Disaster
Peak: Massive media buzz and $1.75 billion in funding Status: Domain acquired by Roku for content library
Quibi might be the most expensive startup failure in entertainment history. Founded by Jeffrey Katzenberg (former Disney chairman) and Meg Whitman (former HP CEO), it launched in April 2020 with premium short-form content designed for mobile viewing during commutes.
The timing was catastrophic — launching during a global pandemic when nobody was commuting. But beyond timing, Quibi fundamentally misunderstood what people wanted: premium $8/month short-form content when YouTube and TikTok were free. It shut down in December 2020, just six months after launch.
The lesson: No amount of funding or star power can save a product that doesn’t match market demand. Timing and user behavior matter more than production value.
Ustream (ustream.tv) — Before Twitch, There Was Ustream
Peak: 80+ million users Status: Domain redirects to IBM Cloud Video
Ustream was the live-streaming pioneer. From citizen journalism to live events to casual broadcasting, Ustream was where you went live before Twitch existed. It had real traction — until IBM acquired it in 2016 and rebranded it as IBM Cloud Video, shifting focus to enterprise use cases.
The lesson: Consumer platforms that get acquired by enterprise companies often lose their soul. The B2C-to-B2B pivot is a survival strategy, not a growth strategy.
Google’s Graveyard: Tools and Services We Lost
Google has killed over 200 products. Some deserved to die. Many didn’t. Here are four that people still miss.
Google Reader (google.com/reader) — The RSS Reader That United the Internet
Peak: Tens of millions of active users Status: Shut down July 2013
Google Reader was the gold standard for RSS reading. For millions of power users, it was their daily command center for consuming the web — subscribe to blogs, news sites, and forums, then read everything in one clean interface.
Google killed it in 2013, arguing that social networks were replacing RSS. The backlash was fierce. Reader’s shutdown is now seen as a turning point: the moment the internet shifted from user-curated feeds to algorithmically controlled timelines.
The lesson: Google Reader’s death marked the end of user-controlled information diets. Its absence created a vacuum that algorithmic feeds (and later, newsletters) rushed to fill.
Google Optimize (optimize.google.com) — Free A/B Testing, Gone
Peak: Millions of websites using it Status: Shut down September 2023
Google Optimize was the go-to free A/B testing tool for marketers and product teams worldwide. It integrated seamlessly with Google Analytics and made experimentation accessible to teams of any size.
Google shut it down in September 2023, directing users to GA4’s built-in experiments. The migration was rocky, and many teams moved to third-party alternatives.
The lesson: Google’s pattern of killing free tools creates trust issues in the developer and marketing community. If you build on Google’s free tools, always have a backup plan.
Google Domains (domains.google.com) — Google Quits the Domain Business
Peak: Millions of domains registered Status: Sold to Squarespace in 2023
Google Domains was widely regarded as one of the best domain registrars — clean interface, transparent pricing, no upsell spam. So when Google announced it was selling the entire business to Squarespace in 2023, customers were frustrated.
For domain investors, the sale highlighted an important truth: domain registration is a relationship business, and when your registrar exits the market, migration is a headache. The silver lining is that alternatives like NamesLink offer similarly clean experiences with integrated domain trading.
The lesson: Even the most trusted registrar can exit the market. Diversifying your domain portfolio across multiple registrars isn’t just convenient — it’s risk management.
Developer Tools That Faded Away
Google Code (code.google.com) — Before GitHub Won
Peak: Hundreds of thousands of open-source projects Status: Shut down January 2016, domain redirects to GitHub
Google Code was Google’s answer to open-source project hosting. It supported SVN, Git, and Mercurial, and hosted major projects like jQuery and AngularJS. But GitHub’s superior UX, social features (starring, forking, pull requests), and community made Google Code feel dated. Google shut it down and encouraged users to migrate to GitHub.
The lesson: In developer tools, community and UX win. GitHub didn’t have Google’s resources — it had better product instincts.
AngularJS (angularjs.org) — The Framework That Defined an Era
Peak: Most popular JavaScript framework, used by millions of developers Status: Long-term support ended January 2022; domain still alive as archive
AngularJS powered an enormous portion of the web during the early 2010s. It was the “A” in the MEAN stack and the framework behind countless enterprise applications. When Google released Angular 2 — a complete rewrite with no backward compatibility — the community fractured. AngularJS entered long-term support mode and was officially deprecated in 2022.
The lesson: Breaking backward compatibility in a major version update can alienate your entire user base. The AngularJS-to-Angular transition is now a cautionary tale taught in software engineering courses.
Communication Apps Google Couldn’t Get Right
Google Hangouts (hangouts.google.com) — The Messaging App That Was Everything
Peak: Hundreds of millions of users (via Gmail integration) Status: Shut down 2022, replaced by Google Chat
Hangouts was Google’s attempt at a unified messaging platform. It handled text, voice, and video across Gmail, Google+, and standalone apps. For years, it was the default video chat tool for businesses and friend groups.
But Google’s messaging strategy was famously chaotic — launching Allo, Duo, Chat, and Meet in rapid succession, each competing for the same users. Hangouts was ultimately killed in favor of Google Chat.
The lesson: Product fragmentation is a strategy killer. Google’s inability to commit to one messaging platform cost them years of user trust.
Google Allo (allo.google.com) — The AI Chat App Nobody Used
Peak: Brief buzz at launch Status: Shut down 2019
Allo was Google’s “smart” messaging app, featuring Google Assistant integration and Smart Reply. It had genuinely innovative features. But competing against WhatsApp, Messenger, and iMessage with their massive installed bases was an uphill battle Google never had a real chance at winning.
The lesson: A better product doesn’t win if the incumbents already own the network effects. Messaging is a winner-take-all market.
Media, Knowledge, and Utility Platforms
Gawker (gawker.com) — The Blog That Got Sued Into Bankruptcy
Peak: Leading digital media brand, millions of daily readers Status: Shut down 2016 after $140M lawsuit verdict (briefly revived in 2018)
Gawker was the most influential — and controversial — blog in tech and culture journalism. Its mix of scoops, snark, and investigative reporting defined digital media in the 2000s and 2010s.
Then came a $140 million lawsuit verdict from Hulk Hogan’s privacy case, funded secretly by billionaire Peter Thiel. Gawker Media filed for bankruptcy and shut down in 2016. It was briefly revived in 2018 but never regained its former influence.
The lesson: Legal risk is an existential threat to media companies. No amount of traffic can protect you from a well-funded legal adversary.
BuzzFeed News (buzzfeednews.com) — Pulitzer Winner, Now Dead
Peak: Major digital news brand with multiple Pulitzer Prizes Status: News division shut down 2023
BuzzFeed News proved that digital-native journalism could win the industry’s highest honors. But the business model — dependent on digital advertising revenue — collapsed as Google and Facebook siphoned away ad dollars, and AI search began diverting traffic. The news division was shuttered in 2023.
The lesson: Award-winning content means nothing without a sustainable business model. The digital advertising ecosystem is increasingly hostile to independent publishers.
Panoramio (panoramio.com) — Geo-Tagged Photos Before Google Maps Ate It
Peak: Popular photo-sharing community with millions of geo-tagged images Status: Shut down November 2016
Panoramio was a beautiful concept: share your photos on a map. You could explore any location on Earth through other people’s eyes. Google acquired it in 2007 and integrated its photos into Google Maps. Then, in 2016, Google shut Panoramio down — its functionality absorbed into Google Maps’ Local Guides program.
The lesson: When Google acquires you, your product may become a feature of something larger. Panoramio’s community didn’t survive the integration.
Freebase (freebase.com) — The Knowledge Base Before Wikidata
Peak: Major collaborative knowledge database, millions of structured facts Status: Shut down 2016, data migrated to Wikidata
Freebase was a structured knowledge database that let anyone contribute facts about any topic. Google acquired it and used its data to power the Knowledge Graph — those info boxes that appear on the right side of Google search results. Freebase was then shut down, with its data migrated to Wikidata.
The lesson: Structured data is incredibly valuable to search engines. Freebase’s DNA lives on every time you see a Google Knowledge Panel.
More Famous Websites That No Longer Exist
The internet graveyard extends well beyond the examples above. Here are seven more websites that once had significant audiences but are now gone.
Posterous (posterous.com) — The Email-to-Blog Platform
Posterous made blogging effortless — literally just send an email and it becomes a blog post. Twitter acquired it in 2012, and the service shut down in April 2013. Its minimalist approach to publishing influenced later tools like Ghost and Substack.
Path (path.com) — The Private Social Network
Path limited your social network to 150 friends (based on Dunbar’s number) and focused on intimate, high-quality sharing. Despite 30 million users and a beautiful design, it couldn’t compete with Facebook and Instagram. Shut down in October 2018.
Google Inbox (inbox.google.com) — The Email Client Ahead of Its Time
Inbox by Gmail introduced features like Snooze, Bundles, and Highlights that made email feel manageable. Millions loved it. Google killed it in 2019 and folded its best features into Gmail — a classic case of the side project getting absorbed by the main product.
FeedBurner (feedburner.com) — The RSS Infrastructure Layer
FeedBurner was the plumbing behind millions of RSS feeds, providing analytics, formatting, and delivery. As RSS declined in favor of social media and newsletters, Google let FeedBurner quietly decay. It still technically exists but has received no meaningful updates since ~2022.
Polymer (polymer-project.org) — Google’s Web Components Library
Polymer was Google’s bet on Web Components becoming the dominant web development paradigm. As browser-native Web Components improved, the library became unnecessary. Maintenance ended in 2021.
Timely (timely.bitspin.ch) — The Beautiful Alarm App
Timely was a cross-device alarm clock app beloved for its clean design. Google acquired the team in 2013 and eventually shut the app down in 2020 — another case of an acqui-hire killing a great product.
Google Helpouts (helpouts.google.com) — Video Tutoring Before Its Time
Helpouts let people offer and receive live video tutoring on any topic. Launched in 2013, it shut down in 2015 due to insufficient demand. The concept was ahead of its time — platforms like MasterClass and Skillshare later proved the market for online learning.
Quick Reference: All 30 Famous Websites That No Longer Exist
| # | Domain | Category | Peak Era | Shutdown Year |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| 1 | myspace.com | Social Media | 100M+ MAU | 2019 (effectively) |
| 2 | friendster.com | Social Media | 115M registered | 2015 |
| 3 | orkut.com | Social Media | 300M+ registered | 2014 |
| 4 | bebo.com | Social Media | 40M+ users | 2013 |
| 5 | plus.google.com | Social Media | 400M accounts | 2019 |
| 6 | stumbleupon.com | Content Discovery | 30M+ users | 2018 |
| 7 | digg.com | Content Aggregation | Top 100 global | 2012 (v4 collapse) |
| 8 | del.icio.us | Social Bookmarking | Millions of users | 2017 |
| 9 | vine.co | Short-form Video | 200M+ users | 2017 |
| 10 | musical.ly | Lip-sync Video | 200M+ users | 2018 (→ TikTok) |
| 11 | quibi.com | Streaming | $1.75B raised | 2020 |
| 12 | ustream.tv | Live Streaming | 80M+ users | 2016 (→ IBM) |
| 13 | google.com/reader | RSS Reader | Tens of millions | 2013 |
| 14 | optimize.google.com | A/B Testing | Millions of sites | 2023 |
| 15 | domains.google.com | Domain Registrar | Millions of domains | 2023 (→ Squarespace) |
| 16 | code.google.com | Code Hosting | Hundreds of thousands of projects | 2016 |
| 17 | angularjs.org | JavaScript Framework | Millions of developers | 2022 (EOL) |
| 18 | hangouts.google.com | Messaging | Hundreds of millions | 2022 |
| 19 | allo.google.com | AI Messaging | Brief buzz | 2019 |
| 20 | gawker.com | Digital Media | Millions daily | 2016 |
| 21 | buzzfeednews.com | Digital News | Pulitzer-winning | 2023 |
| 22 | panoramio.com | Photo Sharing | Millions of photos | 2016 |
| 23 | freebase.com | Knowledge Base | Millions of facts | 2016 |
| 24 | posterous.com | Blogging | Popular platform | 2013 |
| 25 | path.com | Private Social | 30M users | 2018 |
| 26 | feedburner.com | RSS Tools | Millions of feeds | ~2022 (minimal) |
| 27 | timely.bitspin.ch | Alarm App | Acquired by Google | 2020 |
| 28 | helpouts.google.com | Online Education | Google product | 2015 |
| 29 | polymer-project.org | Web Components | Google library | 2021 (EOL) |
| 30 | inbox.google.com | Email Client | Millions of users | 2019 |
Why Do So Many Popular Websites Die?
After reviewing these 30 cases, clear patterns emerge:
Product missteps. Digg v4 is the poster child — one bad redesign can destroy years of community trust overnight.
Acquisition failures. Delicious, Panoramio, Ustream, and Vine were all acquired by larger companies that failed to integrate them successfully. The “acqui-hire” model often kills the product while absorbing the talent.
Google’s kill switch. Google has discontinued over 200 products. Google Reader, Optimize, Domains, Code, Allo, Hangouts — the list goes on. Building on Google’s free tools comes with inherent risk.
First-mover disadvantage. Friendster and MySpace proved the market, but later entrants (Facebook) learned from their mistakes and executed better.
Platform shifts. Every major technology shift — desktop to mobile, RSS to social, social to algorithmic — has claimed victims. The current shift to AI-powered search is no different.
Business model failure. BuzzFeed News won a Pulitzer but couldn’t make money. Gawker won scoops but lost a lawsuit. Revenue — or the lack of it — is the ultimate arbiter.
Can Dead Domains Still Hold Value?
Here’s the question that intrigues many domain investors: just because a website shut down, does that mean its domain is worthless?
Not at all. Many expired or abandoned domains retain significant value based on several factors:
Backlink profiles. When a website like Digg or StumbleUpon was active, thousands (sometimes millions) of other sites linked to it. Those backlinks carry SEO authority that persists even after the site shuts down. A domain with a strong backlink profile can be repurposed for new content and still rank well in search engines.
Brand recognition. Domains like myspace.com or vine.co carry enormous brand awareness. Even if the original product is gone, the name recognition has marketing value.
SEO equity. Years of content, traffic, and indexing build domain authority that doesn’t disappear overnight. Savvy investors look for expired domains with high domain authority (DA) and clean histories.
Memorable names. Short, catchy, keyword-rich domains are always in demand — regardless of what was previously hosted on them.
How to Check a Domain’s Value for Free
Whether you’re eyeing an expired domain or curious about one you already own, knowing its estimated value is the starting point. NamesLink’s free Domain Appraisal Tool uses AI to analyze factors like domain age, keyword value, backlink quality, and comparable sales to give you an instant, explainable valuation.
Unlike some appraisal tools that give you a number with no context, NamesLink shows you why a domain is valued the way it is — breaking down each contributing factor so you can make informed decisions.
Tips for Buying and Selling Domains
If these stories have sparked your interest in domain investing, here are practical tips to get started:
Research the domain’s history. Use the Wayback Machine to see what was previously hosted. Avoid domains with spam or penalty histories.
Get a professional appraisal. Before buying or selling, check the domain’s estimated value to avoid overpaying or underselling.
Understand valuation methods. Domain pricing isn’t arbitrary — learn the key valuation methods that professionals use.
Choose the right marketplace. Not all domain trading platforms are equal. Compare fees, audience, and features before listing.
Diversify your registrar. As the Google Domains → Squarespace migration showed, putting all your domains with one registrar is risky. Platforms like NamesLink offer both registration and trading in one place, making portfolio management easier.
Frequently Asked Questions
What is the most famous website that no longer exists?
MySpace is arguably the most famous defunct website. At its peak, it was the most visited website in the United States with over 100 million monthly users. Other notable examples include Vine (200M+ users), Google+ (400M accounts), and Orkut (300M+ registered users).
Why do popular websites shut down?
The most common reasons are: competition from newer platforms (MySpace vs. Facebook), failed product redesigns (Digg v4), acquisition mismanagement (Delicious by Yahoo), business model failure (BuzzFeed News), and strategic shifts by parent companies (Google killing 200+ products).
Can I still buy expired domains from dead websites?
Yes. Many expired domains from defunct websites are available through domain marketplaces and auctions. Before purchasing, always appraise the domain’s value and check its history using the Wayback Machine.
How do I find out what a domain is worth?
Free domain appraisal tools like NamesLink’s Domain Appraisal can give you an instant AI-powered estimate based on factors like domain age, keyword strength, comparable sales, and backlink quality.
What happened to Google’s many discontinued products?
Google has shut down over 200 products. Some were absorbed into other Google services (Reader’s functionality partly replaced by social feeds), some were sold (Google Domains to Squarespace), and others were simply discontinued. The Killed by Google website maintains a comprehensive graveyard.
What These Famous Websites That No Longer Exist Teach Us About Domains
The internet has a short memory. Websites that once defined our daily routines — checking Digg over morning coffee, stumbling through StumbleUpon on lazy afternoons, recording Vines on weekends — now exist only in our memories and the Wayback Machine.
But their domains tell a continuing story. Some redirect to new owners. Some sit parked, waiting for the right buyer. And some carry enough SEO authority and brand recognition to launch entirely new ventures.
Whether you’re a nostalgic internet veteran reminiscing about the good old days, or a domain investor looking for the next opportunity, understanding why these famous websites that no longer exist rose and fell is invaluable knowledge in today’s digital landscape.
Curious about a domain’s value? Try NamesLink’s free Domain Appraisal Tool — enter any domain name and get an instant, AI-powered valuation with a full breakdown. You can also browse and trade domains on NamesLink’s marketplace to find your next great domain investment.
Which of these websites do you remember? Share your internet nostalgia in the comments below.
